Become an Impressive and Effective Podcast Guest Featuring Kristin Molenaar

Dallin (00:00):

Welcome to Visionaries where we believe your powerful message is the best way to grow your business. Impact the world to live a meaningful life. Today, we are talking with Kristin Molenaar. Kristin, how are you?

Kristin (00:11):

I'm doing well. How are you this morning?

Dallin (00:13):

Good. Did I say your last name right? Molenaar?

Kristin (00:15):

No. No!

Dallin (00:15):

I didn't even ask you, before we started! How would you say your last day?

Kristin (00:23):

It's Molenaar.

Dallin (00:28):

I'm not embarrassed at all. No Molenaar Kristin Molenaar well, Hey Kristin, thank you so much. Um, so your company is called Yes Boss. Um, tell us a little bit more about your brand and why you do what you do.

Kristin (00:42):

Yeah, so Yes Boss is an agency that helps entrepreneurs, a lot of service-based entrepreneurs, generate leads for their business by being featured as a podcast guest. Um, this kind of happened out of an organic ebb and flow of me going from, you know, entrepreneurial failure to virtual assistant, to virtual assistant agency to we really need to niche down and I want to be able to serve our clients in a really efficient and effective way. Well, building a sustainable business for myself that, that, um, I feel, you know, really works for our clients, but also is able to grow in a way that's not going to like break me, right. So I want to be able to scale. Um, so we do what we do because about a year and a half ago, my virtual assistant agency was running really well. It ran itself.

Kristin (01:35):

And, um, I had realized that entrepreneurship doesn't have to be quite as hard as I had made it in the past. And I wanted to really just get out and share what I had learned about entrepreneurship with the rest of the world. So I'm on a mission to eradicate entrepreneurial stress. It sounds really big, but I feel like if I could just get in the room with enough people and just tell like one person with each conversation, like, look, it doesn't have to be so hard. That would be great. And what ended up happening is to share my message. I started doing podcast interviews because that just felt like a very natural way to get out there. And it became our number one lead generation strategy. And it was then that we all kind of looked at it and went, Whoa, this is kind of wild. I didn't go into it with that intent. Um, so we started doing the same with our clients and we noticed that I wasn't just like a unicorn, you know, this was a really effective lead-generation strategy if you do it right. And now that is what we do exclusively. We specialize in this and I just live and breathe podcasts all day. And that's what my team does too. So!

Dallin (02:38):

Wow. That's so good. Well, I love that you niched down further from, I mean, like you have this operating VA agency turned into podcasts, all that growth, cause you all own a system that works. Um, and I let somebody that really sticks out to me too. And you hinted at it, uh, in your introduction is this mantra of work less and make more, uh, tell me what more about what that means to you and how you're looking to live true to that.

Kristin (03:07):

Yeah. You know, this is something that, um, I actually found to be a truth before it became a mantra for me. So, um, I kind of mentioned that I started with entrepreneurial failure. You know, I left corporate for the last time in 2014, for 14 months after leaving corporate, I struggled, you know, I thought that, you know, I have this, uh, experience and the these smarts in this certain industry, I'm just going to be a coach and consultant. Like, I'm just going to create a course. And I'll just like, create all this stuff and people will just come and buy it. Um, I did all the things, you know, once when you're an entrepreneur and especially Facebook gets a hold of that information, you start being targeted by a lot of really smart marketers telling you that you've got to do everything to run your business.

Kristin (03:56):

And I bought into it because I didn't know better at the time. So I was doing, you know, like webinars and I was doing courses and challenges and yeah, as a cert, well, no, no, no. This was my marketing to get myself as an entrepreneur out there. I was doing all these backend tactics. So I was doing everything. It was kind of like spray and pray for me. It did it, it didn't understand, you know, the, the, um, elements of a sales funnel necessarily. I just knew like market market market get out there, get out there, get out there. So I was doing all the things. I made $5,000 in that business. I decided like, this is this sucks. You know, I can't do this anymore. So then the stark difference that I saw is I started, I became a virtual assistant. I wanted to just make some money.

Kristin (04:44):

And so I got my first virtual assistant gig making just $15 an hour, which admittedly was like, you know, I was excited to have like something bringing in money, but that was pretty darn low. Like when I left corporate, I was making way more than $15 an hour. And here I am trying to maintain an ounce of freedom, but I wondered if it could even work. But what I noticed within just a couple of weeks of getting my first virtual assistant gig is that I could actually leverage the support of other people. So I was told that the client that I got wanted me to write a blog and I said, yeah, I could do that. You know? Yes, woman over here and then sat down to write the blog. Yeah. Right. So I sat down to write the blog and went, this is horrible.

Kristin (05:28):

I can't believe I'm doing this. So I found an intern in like the Midwest and she was in college at the time. She wanted to make seven or eight bucks an hour, whatever minimum wage was there. And I realized in that moment, okay, even making just $15 an hour, if I leverage that I can take off every single restriction or every single cap that I have on my income, because I can outsource a hundred hours a week, 200 hours a week, 300 hours a week. Like I'm not going to be limited by own capacity. And so I realized in that moment that, um, I had really hit on something. So I continued to scale the virtual assistant agency. And I then, because I was scaling it in such a way where I guess my thinking with it was that I wanted it to be like this side hustle.

Kristin (06:15):

I wanted it to just pay for things so I could do my quote real business. And so I started other businesses on the side and continued with the same, do everything spray and pray tactics with the other businesses. And what I noticed then was that the business that I had kept streamlined and the one that I had a very strategic, like make money, but don't spend enough, don't spend too much time in it. Like I was very strict about that with the virtual assistant agency, that one just continued to grow almost effortlessly because I had really figured out how to get people in the door. Right. But these other businesses that I was doing just felt like pushing a boulder up a hill. So it was in that, that I realized like work less, make more, is actually a strategy. And I need to make it my mantra to remind myself, like, Kristin, stop putting yourself in stuff like bottlenecking things, like stop making every single business dependent on just what I can do and start leveraging things so that you can continue to grow.

Dallin (07:16):

Wow. Wow. So it was really born out of a necessity for you to really change things because you found, was there like a burnout point where you found that you were working more and making less, I mean, it kind of sounds like that, right. When you were trading early on trading time for money.

Kristin (07:34):

So I didn't hit a burnout point so much. Like I wouldn't call it that, but what did happen? What shifted is my son came to us as a 10 day old foster baby and I was running two businesses. So I had this like, you know, business that I thought was, you know, my dream business kind of thing. And then I wasn't making any money. And then I had the virtual assistant agency that I was really just working five hours per week, but it was supporting my whole household. And it was then that I realized like, okay, I'm a new mom. Now there's no way that I can continue to put 40 plus hours in this business. That's not making any money. I've really got to just let this go and be a good steward of like those five hours that I've got to run the profitable business. So it wasn't so much a breaking point. I think if I had continued, I would have broken for sure. Cause I was running on not much sleep at the time. So yeah, that for me was the shift

Dallin (08:28):

That was because of being a mom!

Kristin (08:29):

Baby. Yep. Yeah.

Dallin (08:33):

Wow. Well, you know, and I love that too, because I think we get pulled into and I'll speak for myself for sure. Here is this idea that, you know, the more and more we, we work. And honestly, it's still a struggle, like, because I feel like part, sometimes part of my hobbies become the brand building side. So it's like, Hey, I've got like leisure time. Why not like tinker around with, you know, other aspects of the business, but uh, I think we get sucked into this workaholic type mentality because the hustle and grind culture is real. And, uh, but also the, uh, the stress and the burnout culture is real too. And in fact, even just yesterday, I was talking to, um, someone else on a podcast interview and, and he talked about this idea of burnout and how even, you know, seemingly the most successful people, you know, making millions of dollars or, you know, doing all these amazing things in their business. Um, they have burnout and they experienced say like what the young or like new to business hustlers doing as well. So the fact that you caught that before it extreme burnout is incredible. And then it speaks to the mission you shared earlier on, around eradicate and entrepreneurial stress, you know, what kind of, um, that mission statement one is so simple. Uh, but to what kind of brought it about, like, was it more on the workings of what you just shared? Uh, tell us a little bit more about like, why that speaks to you.

Kristin (10:03):

Yeah. There was a few things going on behind the scenes that I noticed about myself, that I, as I started to share them, I noticed them to be true about other people. So we definitely live in a hustle culture. Um, I think a lot of us come by it, honestly, I, I was raised by hard workers, you know, people that you taught me to get a job and you stay with it, you get good retirement, you get good benefits. You stay there, you know, you work your way up

Dallin (10:28):

I mean, yeah, that was so much a part of the culture.

Kristin (10:32):

Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, I came by it honestly, but then what I then found specific to entrepreneurship is that I brought a lot of the employee mentality over into entrepreneurship. So I was a fantastic employee and I thought that that would make me a fantastic entrepreneur. And I couldn't have been further from the truth because as an employee, you want to prove all the things that you can do to prove your value. Well, what I found with entrepreneurship is I kept adding to a to-do list and I kept, um, inserting myself into areas in my business that didn't need fixing, essentially because I wanted to be a hero. And I got an ego boost from doing things from doing a long list of things. So it was, I wanted to be a hero. I got an ego boost. And, um, let me just like dig into that a little bit more.

Kristin (11:22):

I think that when we have a long list of things to do, we can walk away at the end of the day and be like so proud of ourselves because of all the things that we've accomplished. And I think that we've got to look at our to-do list and think like how many of those things were actually really, truly necessary to moving our business along and how many of them are ultimately self-sabotage. So we have this idea that entrepreneurship is just like working, working, working. And I think that a of people have substituted entrepreneurship for what really should be coined as self-employment, because entrepreneurship is really being a visionary leader that puts people in processes into place. I don't think enough people are seeing their business as something that is outside of themselves. They're seeing their business as them. And as seeing it like that, your business is never going to grow independence.

Kristin (12:18):

You're never going to have freedom from it though. I believe that a lot of entrepreneurs go into entrepreneurship because they want freedom, but they're not setting themselves up for that freedom because it's like, I am my business, I have all this perfectionism and like, I'm getting so, so much from being the hero in my business and doing all the things and I can never let anybody do anything else. And I want to be everywhere because I see these other people, but I love they're everywhere too. Well, you don't have to be everywhere to be successful. So I think we have to step back and evaluate. Did you want to be an entrepreneur for the way it made you look or did you want to be an entrepreneur for the lifestyle that it gave you? And for me, I made a very distinct difference. Like I don't have an Instagram and I don't do Facebook and I don't do all those like massive publicity things. Yes. I do podcast interviews, but, but that's it because I know that this works and this is within my zone of genius. And I know that I'm adding value all around by doing these things. I'm not tinkering in the stuff that I know essentially makes me a bottleneck or diverts my focus. So I guess there's like a lot that I just said there.

Dallin (13:24):

I I'm like you're talking through it cause I'm like, Oh my gosh, like, yes, yes. That sounds to me. I, um, you know, E-Myth, have you heard of that book? Yes, I have. For what? 20 some years, uh, I listened to it literally finished it like a week ago and I'm like, yes, yes. This speaks to me, you know, this is something I've been working on, but I mean, you're, you're preaching to someone who needs to be reminded and hear it, you know, cause it is like a lot of us get, uh, fall into that trap. And, and I believe it's like a downward spiral if we allow ourselves to stay there around being the self-employed, uh, employee, uh, really to our business, like we're, we're an employee to us being the boss, you know? And, uh, and when we're doing all the things in the technician type role, which is outlined in the E-Myth, um, then we're, you know, we can be in that place for the next, you know, 20, 30, 40 years of our career.

Dallin (14:24):

Um, and even if we make okay money at it, um, it's, I feel like it's a recipe for some kind of burnout and definitely stress, right. Which is what you're trying to eradicate. Um, and those are moments that I've experienced that like, you know, I've, I'm making certain decisions. Um, this year that I I'm seeing like steps in and transformation out of that, that pit that we can definitely fall into. So, um, I'm, I'm inspired what you just shared. Uh, and I feel like it's very relevant to not only me, but many others who are aspiring visionaries in that. You're definitely right. Like there's either self-employment or there there's entrepreneurship where you're the business owner owning systems. Um, I do want to dig a little bit, unless you have anything else to add. Um,

Kristin (15:10):

You can take it somewhere else. That's fine. Yeah. I went on a bunch of little tangents in my answer.

Dallin (15:16):

Yeah, it's good. Um, uh, you know, you mentioned the podcast stuff. Um, I want to dig into some practical yeah. I guess, techniques, um, that you find work so well, because not many people can say they've doubled down on just kind of one traffic source. Right. My business is called Content Supply. So it's all about how can we get your message out there specifically video, but we train it, you know, and all different types of content and a and podcast is definitely one of those powerful ways. Do your message out there. But, uh, people don't specialize, you know, they, they feel like that, like you said, they have to be everywhere. Um, what kind of benefit have you seen, um, in specializing in what are in podcasting and what are some first steps someone can take to do that in the podcasting world?

Kristin (16:06):

Yeah. So, um, I think that kind of giving an explanation of how I see being a podcast guest, um, I think is a good place for me to start in my answer and maybe we can go from there. Um, so I think that when somebody thinks about being a podcast guest, they can put it in one of two categories. The first one is it's traditional marketing, which makes sense. It is marketing. So what you want to do with traditional marketing is you basically show up in front of somebody else's audience. So somebody else has captured an audience that you want to speak to. And you're looking for big audiences and audiences that are aligned with your message. Yeah, that's true. Right. The next thing is a traditional PR approach. So traditional PR means like you want to get featured so that you can get that logo.

Kristin (16:49):

And it says like, you know, featured on Forbes or whatever, so that you can put that on your website, plastered everywhere to really boost your credibility because you've been featured somewhere that everybody knows. So most of the time people see being a podcast guest put in one of those two categories. I actually see it different. I see this as an opportunity to connect. So what I have found is my business until I was doing this really grew a lot by referral. So it was people that had already hired us, were referring us to other people, but also other entrepreneurs that I was meeting just learned about what I was doing. And they would tell people in their circles about what I was doing and they would make referrals that way. What has happened with being a podcast guest. And this is, this is really whenever we have a client come to us, I have to make sure that they understand this distinction because we work with people who just want to connect with the right influencers.

Kristin (17:41):

So I look at podcasting as an opportunity to connect with someone new. So I'm looking at, do I like what this podcast host is saying, do I want to be in a professional relationship with this person? Is this someone that I want in my circle? Is this somebody that I would love to network with? Is this somebody that if I saw in a conference, I would want to go over and shake their hand and say like, Hey, I'm Kristin. Like we should get to know one another. It's all about connection for me. And I think what happens when you go into something with connection in mind is you're able to leave, like all the sales and the tactics you're able to leave it behind and really go in and want to just share value and connect with somebody. Um, I think that we've lost sight of the value of connection a lot in business, because we're so worried about like the next, you know, I talk about this in my traditional bio.

Kristin (18:38):

Like we're so worried about the vanity metrics, like build the email list. Yes. Build the Instagram following. Yes. Build the, you know, viewers that are monthly viewers that come to your website. Yes. All those things. And so I discovered that connection was at the core of this because after I did my first few podcast interviews, I realized, Oh, you know what? Like every podcast host is asking me what my opt-in is. Like, if I have a freebie, they're offering this to me, we need to get something on the backend, like, ah, get this together. You know, what I noticed though, is that as very small portion of the people that actually listened to the episode wanted to come on my email list and to be frank, the people that wanted to come onto my email list were not the most ideal clients. The most ideal clients, especially with a service-based business, the most ideal clients are the ones that hear you talk about what you know, and go you're awesome, you're right.

Kristin (19:36):

I don't want to do it. You do it. They're not signing up for your email list to learn the DIY stuff. Now I want to serve those people. And I want to be able to give them, you know, if I can do it, um, in an effective and efficient way, I want to be able to give them that information. But what I was finding is either there's a working relationship with the host or there's a working relationship with somebody that the host knows. Like it's more about that networking and getting into community with other podcast hosts. Like I think that you can attest to, if somebody is an entrepreneur and they are doing a podcast, they're a serious entrepreneur because taking on a podcast is not an easy task. So that's a major differentiating factor in how I see being a podcast guest, as opposed to what somebody might traditionally think it is.

Dallin (20:23):

Wow. You know, I'm so glad you shared that and that you, you presented two solutions that people often look or outcomes they want right out of the podcast, which I completely agree with. Uh, and I remember, I mean, I, I think I've gone through three names of a podcast and I, it took like hiatus of it when I first started. Um, but, but really like, I love you shared this cause like, this was what it started out for me. And as it is for you, right. Like I just, I was hungry to meet more people because here I came from like you again from a corporate world where you have in person colleagues interact with, and all of a sudden you're working from home and you see someone like we're doing now on a screen across the country or world. And, uh, and so you have like, I'm hungry for that connection that you do need for, for just like your sanity, your creative juices, but also your, um, your business growth.

Dallin (21:21):

And, uh, and so like, it was a way for me to meet people and, and vanity metrics aside, like, you know, most people don't ask what your download metrics are for your podcast to be like, I'm going to qualify you before I get on your podcast. Because I think at the end of the day, people who are guests or hosting a podcast, um, they just want, they want that visibility that comes with the podcast for sure. But people often just like talking about themselves right. And sharing their perspective and stories because at the end of the day, like, I think everyone's selfish in some form and that's that's okay. Right. And so, um, I found that making that connection, um, particularly like you said, the right ones is powerful and you you're saying towards the end, I was like, Oh my gosh, already, before you brought this up, I was like, I'm going to talk to Kristin after we're done recording. And we're going to talk about opportunities to work together. Cause I was like, I feel like, you know, I could use some form of her services. Uh, and, uh, and, and so I think it's powerful way to definitely connect. Um, one thing I'm interested in, and this is again in your bio, but you talked about how, um, you help through podcasts features you help others generate new leads with just one hour per week. What does that look like?

Kristin (22:35):

Yeah! That's a good question. And without knowing it, you already kind of answered part of what I'm going to say. So when a client comes to us, obviously they're interested in generating new leads. Like this is our focus. We want to help people get more, more clients into their business. And so what I would say it to, or what I do say to clients that come in the door is what we do for you is help you find people that you can establish new connections with, but it is your job to maintain that relationship on the backend. So if you know, I did actually just talk to you in the last couple of weeks, somebody that came in and he said, you know, I'm throwing money at Facebook ads and I'm throwing money at all this paid advertisement. And I want to give it a shot doing podcast guesting, and I've done guesting in the past, but it never yielded any clients.

Kristin (23:23):

My question for him was, well, are you still in connection with the people that interviewed you or did you just show up and then dip out because that's not going to yield any quality leads for your business? So the reason that you answered this question is you said that you wanted to stay on the call and talk after this interview. That's the very first thing to do. So if you're interested in being an effective podcast guest, make sure that you know, that you're going into this to form some new relationships. And what I find is the best relationships are started right after an interview. Like you've just talked about some really interesting things. I feel like the, um, amount of information that's shared during a podcast interview is like having a discovery call and a sales call at a coaching call. Like it's all like kind of wrapped up in this one recorded conversation.

Kristin (24:17):

There's a bunch of stuff to talk about afterwards. So make sure that as a podcast guests, though, that you're being others focused. So we're putting together some templates for our clients to just make sure that they're getting, you know, some bullet points down after an interview. But very first thing is asking the person that's just interviewed that just interviewed you, how can I be a value to you? How can I be a valuable connection to what you're doing in your business? I feel that when we open ourselves up to be of service opportunities, to serve people in monetized ways, also open themselves up to so sometimes being a value to somebody else's business just means connecting them to somebody else in your network and just continuing to be a connector of other people. But what happens is you then get more and more visibility for your business.

Kristin (25:09):

More people know what you have to offer, and that ends up being profitable for your business. So that's like that relationship follow-up. But I also want to say one more thing, because I think that it's important. Um, the person, the right podcast guest, if you want to go into it to, you know, generate leads for your business, you've got to succinctly know what you offer. So I think that this is so important because I talk to people that say like, you know, I have relationships with people. Like, what's, what's the other thing, like, what else am I missing? And often what I find it's it's that you just aren't communicating clear enough who it is that you help. You know, my offer is like, so, so simple. Like I just help people get on podcasts as guests. But an example that I like to give is I have a copywriting friend and copywriting is a very general umbrella.

Kristin (26:02):

She's been on podcasts. And what happens is she's walked away and said, you know, nobody's made any referrals. Nobody's actually hired me because essentially they just don't know what they would hire her to do. So you don't ever want to walk away from a podcast episode, having the host go, I would've hired you because I liked you, but I didn't even know like what kind of referrals I would make. So there's those two things, make sure to follow up on the relationship. And before you ever become a guest, make sure that you're able to succinctly talk about what it is that you do. So there's no confusion.

Dallin (26:34):

Yeah. Wow. That's so powerful. I was, I was taking notes because ideas are coming to my mind. Um, again, that kind of coaching, uh, discovery call aspect. Uh, another, another aspect too, that I want to hit on, you know, the aspect of generating needs from the podcast, obviously there's that built in one lead from person that you interact with, but how do you see leads grow from there? Um, as far as like the continuation of the relationship, getting access to the audience, like what are some, what are some practical steps, um, to see lead generation, you know, scale quickly?

Kristin (27:10):

Yeah. So my, my favorite is that is when the podcast hosts makes, tell somebody about what you do. Um, you know, we just started working with somebody that emailed me and said, Hey, you were just featured on my friend's podcast. I didn't listen to the episode, but I read his email talking about your episode. And I knew I needed to hire you. Like, how can we work together? So people like this come to you, pre-sold that I think is my favorite kind of lead is somebody that's like my friend, you know, I asked my friend if you're worth hiring and he gave me a thumbs up. And so you don't even have to sell me. I just need to know how to get started. Like, that's my favorite kind of lead. Um, but I think what also happens is, is a number of things. So there's the audience that hears you.

Kristin (27:49):

And depending on the audience, sometimes there are leads in that audience, you know, just from, you know, getting the episode air, sometimes their leads that come from there. Um, other times there are leads that come from engaging on some of the social media, like promotional content that goes out. So one thing that I recently saw is I had a friend on LinkedIn listened to my podcast episode and then share about that podcast that I was featured on with her audience, because she was just excited about the content that she learned and then somebody from her audience. I don't know if you're following this.

Dallin (28:27):

Yeah. This has happened before too. But yeah. Keep going.

Kristin (28:31):

Somebody from her audience commented on it and went, Oh, I know that podcast. I know that podcast, I need what that girl, Me, has to offer. And then they reached out to me. So it was just this like really weird social media. It was, it was it all came this is what I want to say. It all came from both the podcast host, promoting the episode and me promoting the episode. So I posted about that episode on my LinkedIn. I posted a snippet of that episode that the podcast host gave me to share. I love doing that. And that then like, opened up all of these other audiences with other connections that I never would have, would have seen just because of the power of social media and that promotion. So there's a, there's a number of things going on here.

Dallin (29:20):

Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Do you find, uh, in your system, um, cause I find this as popular and honestly kind of like a, kind of like a rote process where at the end of a podcast interview, you're like, where can people learn more about you get a free resource? Do you find that as far as like, does that disconnect the connection of a relationship, um, that you're trying to establish the podcast feature? Or do you find like that's a pretty natural thing to include? I'm just, I'm curious to hear your perspective, you know, the podcast feature, um, niche, whether that is, uh, an important thing to do or that you find the follow-up, there's more power and follow up.

Kristin (30:02):

So my take is, I don't care if the podcast host asked me to tell people where to go or not. I don't care. Yeah. Because I feel that if, so, if I've done my job, right, somebody that's listening can work me out of a job. Somebody can DIY me out of a job. Like I want to give enough information. If I'm talking about being a podcast guest, I want to give enough information that your listeners can do my job for me, but that's not my ideal audience is not my ideal audience is the person that doesn't know how to do it. It's the person that chooses not to do it, that chooses to hire somebody else to do it because they've got more important things to do. So I don't care if somebody asks me what my freebie offer link is. I don't care if somebody asks me where to follow me on LinkedIn, when the right person hears you, it's pretty easy to find the person that's been featured.

Kristin (30:54):

You know, I don't know of any podcast hosts that don't at least share some way to find their guests. So I'm not worried about that. I feel like if you share enough valuable information, you're going to prove that, you know what you're talking about enough. And then when it comes to the podcast hosts, like we know how to connect with one another and that's, there's no issue there. So it's neither here nor there for me. I just go along with whatever the podcast host wants to do. And I just show up and try to be as valuable of a person as I possibly can.

Dallin (31:24):

Yeah. Yeah. That's really good perspective. And respecting the format that the podcast host likes to run their show, I, you know, I've just found, like I'll just kind of speak honestly to, this is like I've often probably like 95 plus percent of my episodes have concluded with that because that kind of feels like a natural, like, Oh, maybe I should pay homeage, you know, some kind of additional homeage apart from giving them a platform to share a lot of their, their strategies and stories. But sometimes I feel like it's unnatural to do where it's like, Hey, thanks for this conversation. I appreciate it. Let's stay connected. And then wrap up. They're like, yeah, there may be like a template. Uh, and I know we do that in my show, a template called simple call to action at the end. Um, but, uh, yeah, no, it's, it's fascinating.

Dallin (32:09):

Cause I've been thinking about like, what are ways that I can continue to evolve the format of a podcast, um, future, um, whether it's guests or solo podcast episode, um, and particularly, uh, like I, I found that I really leaned into the storytelling aspect where you it's coming to talk about their story and that's great and all you can learn and get inspired from different aspects. But, um, I also, like, I I'm, I'm, I'm trying to like shift my mind around, how can we get into talking about more practical, next steps someone can take, you know, like you'll, you'll get inspired for sure, but like, what can I actually do? And the fact that, you know, you shared that and I love that we can get into those things so people can take away actionable, um, you know, strategies or homework, so to speak, uh, to DIY, but obviously with the right person to, um, to hire.

Kristin (33:05):

Yeah. I, I actually say that your stories have the most power when they have action attached to them. And that's how we write our pitches for our clients, because we found that that worked for me. Like, you know, not going into the episode, wanting to just share all your accolades, but you share your accomplishments to drive home a point. Like there's gotta be a value add tie in to everything that you say, like I could show up and be like, yeah, I went from $15 an hour VA to, you know, six figure entrepreneur like cool, good job, Kristin. But like, what's the point here? The point is you can start leveraging, even if you're only making $15 an hour, like that's a message. That's an action. That's something that's tied to what I have to say. That's going to have value to the person listening. So it's interesting to hear you talk about it as a podcast host, because I tell the podcast guests like, don't, I, I'm not going to help you if you say, I just want to show up and just share my story. Well, what's the point of the story? Like, why do people need to know your story? I'm not going to just give you like help you get a platform to just talk all about yourself. You've got to tie in that giving aspect to everything that you talk about.

Dallin (34:24):

Yes. Yeah. And I think that it applies in storytelling overall. Like there's a key part, um, like, uh, how we work the Content Supply's in three phases of messaging, marketing, and then medium. And in the messaging phase, obviously the story you tell should be about your customer, them as the hero or heroine, and the idea behind that it's, it's tricky. And I think it, it stops people from moving forward with developing a better messaging strategy because they're like, I just don't want to talk about myself or I feel like if I tell my story, then this happens. And, and I think as long as like, like you're saying to, um, not only including actual strategies, but understanding like is the story I'm telling, um, the same path that my customers need to go on, whether I'm sharing a customer story or my own story about, and I think it's sometimes it's a hard line to, to, to walk. Um, but it's better to lean into just doing it and practicing it, um, then avoiding it altogether. Uh, great. Well, this has been really good. Uh, you've given so many amazing, uh, practical steps. You've shared your story. You've done, you know, everything that we're about and it's incredible. Uh, and I appreciate your time today, Kristin. It's been a great conversation.

Kristin (35:42):

Yeah, I agree. It was fun. I feel like we were able to take a few little, little pads on the conversation, but, um, yeah. I mean, being able to show up and talk in a space where I had the opportunity to just help somebody just make their life a little bit easier. It's totally worth it for me. So I loved this conversation. I think it was a lot of fun.

Dallin (36:01):

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