Guiding Women Through the Biological Clock: Insights From a Male Perspective

I try to bring the male perspective but I try to bring a sophisticated emotionally intelligent

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enlightened male perspective so you know I'm not the man who's going to be like

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oh you know if you don't have a guy by 40 you're useless or whatever like you hear a lot of you know that sort of

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stuff online um but I'm sure we'll get into this more I'm also not the man who's going to tell you like if you're

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38 and single you're exactly where you need to be in life and you're perfect

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like you don't want to hear that because you don't feel that way internally you you know you want to feel worthy and

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lovable but you also want to know is there anything I can do is there

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something that's blocking [Music]

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me okay well Kevin welcome to quiet the clock thank you so much for being here Kevin high thank you thank coach speaker

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um I what I've loved so much about doing this podcast is being connected to new people and I love that you had actually

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reached out to me and we got on a call and you're like I work in the space I am

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passionate about the space and I thought that was amazing as a male um that you work with women going through egg

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freezing or fertility and you you really care about women going through that and you really care about this topic so

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thank you uh can you share a little bit more about how you just who you are what you do and how you became interested in

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you know supporting women in this space yes absolutely so first of all I think what you're doing is amazing thank you

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and it's very cool that we're able to have this conversation in person I know I know so thank you for coming all the

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way from the East Coast yeah we came just to talk to you I'm sure yeah me me and everybody else of course I'm just

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honored to be in the rotation we're honored no we're honored to have you um but yeah I'm a therapist and a coach and

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a speaker here in LA and um over the the past 5 years I've a large contingent of

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my practice has been women in their late 30s early 40s who are struggling to find

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the right person they feel the the pressure of the biological clock they feel the social pressure they feel the

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family pressure and as I've worked with them you know this this topic of egg freezing

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always comes up should I do it should I not there's a lot of taboo around it it's very expensive yes it's not a

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position that you know most people would recommend to their best friend that you

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be in it's it's something that they kind of find themselves in exactly yeah we just yeah the guess that we just had on

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same thing is like you just don't think you'll have to do this and that's one of the things I think that uh ends up being

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the reason women find themselves at a fortil clinic at 36 37 I froze at 37 is

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yeah you just don't think you're going to be in this position yeah so that's something that I you know have

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encountered over over and over again and I sort of figured that okay if I'm really going to be supportive to my

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clientele I need to learn more about what this process entails so I did kind

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of a deep dive I met with a bunch of fertility uh doctors I love that I partner with two of them now um where we

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sort of collaborate and try to be on the same page and sort of co-manage patient

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care you know I love that collabtive care do you mind mentioning their names in case anyone's interested in uh let

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Meck I'll check with them first just CU I didn't ask okay yeah yeah yeah but I just that collaborative piece because I

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think that the more resources or support you can have in this process is so incredibly important yeah I'm sure it

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won't be a problem we can link it in the episode yeah yeah yeah um but yeah you know I learned like the names of the

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medications I learned the cost I learned about the retrieval procedure you know so that way I could sort of speak to my

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clients like you know on in the same language yeah um but I also you know the

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the most that I've learned is about the emotional and psychological process behind all of this

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and it's it's interesting I'm a straight male I will never have to be pregnant I

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will never have to freeze my eggs yes so no you won't you know you know it's I'm

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I'm not sort of the the typical person who's talking about this I do want to talk about that because one I think it's

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incredible that you are interested and you're so um passionate about just knowing more and and knowing more in

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order to support your clients and I'm I'm curious about what your clients's response are to you knowing so much I

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I'm curious about what their response is to knowing that you'll never have to go through this that as much as you can

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know in terms of knowledge and medications like you maybe there's this disconnect into how you can relate to

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the emotional piece well um the thing is that a lot of the clients that I've had

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don't have an a strong external source of support particularly if they're from

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immigrant families you tend to see that the parents are not so supportive of this um sometimes they don't want to

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talk to their friends about it because there's a you know it can be a source of Shame unfortunately which I'm sure will

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demystify yes yes sometimes if they're dating someone newly dating someone or if they're single and they want to start

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they want to get into a relationship they're worried about how they're they're going to bring it up so I know my limitations I always tell them what

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I'm telling you like look I'll never have to go through this so I'm not trying to pretend that I can put myself

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in your shoes but I can definitely be a source of strength and encouragement and

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support as you go through this and I also happen to know a bit about the process so that you know that way you

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don't feel like I'm completely on a different yeah and I thought it was so great on our call you're like okay I'm not just some weirdo reaching out to you

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I actually Joy I I know this space I work in this space and even just hearing you talk about it now you are so

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well-versed in what women go through and just like the shame and how to bring it up on a date like these are all the

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things that do come up yeah for sure and I I also try I think this is one of the

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reason that my clients have felt comfortable with me I try to bring the male perspective well that's huge we

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always want the well we want the male perspective until we don't want the male perspective I was going to say you don't

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you only want the male perspective if it sounds you know nice you're right it's true it's so bad

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but that's so true you're you're the fourth mail we've had on and we do we

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you're 100% right we do want the male perspective but some of the things we're hearing are hard to hear and it's not

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that they are untrue right but it's not really what we want to be hearing but I think that think incredibly important

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perspective well look I don't I try to bring the male perspective but I try to bring a

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sophisticated emotionally intelligent enlightened male perspective so you know

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I'm not the man who's going to be like oh you know if you don't have a guy by

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40 you're useless or whatever like you hear a lot of you know that sort of stuff online um but I'm sure we'll get

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into this more I'm also not the man who's going to tell you like if you're 38 and single you're exactly where you

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need to be in life and you're perfect like you don't want to hear that because you don't feel that way internally you

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you know you want to feel worthy and lovable but you also want to know is there anything I can do is there

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something that's blocking me and when it comes sorry go ahead go ahead gohe and and then you know when when it comes to

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the egg freezing thing you know I think what I've experienced is that a lot of women are terrified to have this

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conversation uh with men either that they are newly dating or that they're going to start dating or whatever and I

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I I really believe because I've seen it over and over again that if you are dating somebody who has a certain level

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of emotional intelligence and you tell him you're freezing your eggs he is going to respect you for that

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and he's going to see that as an insurance policy that you are taking

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this seriously and you are not just living in a la la land that you don't

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have to take precautions against this yeah okay wait there's so much to unpack with everything you just said there okay

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so let let me just say right off the bat I'm not here to say don't tell guys you're going to scare them off they

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don't want to hear that that's all nonsense right agreed obviously there's there's a certain type of guy who's

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going to be scared off but if he if he is on a date with a woman who's 35 or 38

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and he's not smart enough to know that fertility is going to become a part of the conversation at some point then

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you're probably not on the same wavelength to begin with right right we had a guest on here who was going

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through her egg freezing on a second date with her husband well Future Husband wasn't her husband at the time

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second date with this guy that would end up being her husband and and you know you have to do the shots at the same time every night she excused herself

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from the table did her shot and she's like I'm going to come back and tell him and he was like great good for you I think that's great now they're they're

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married and I think you're right that there is a certain kind of man that will respect that and like imp be like

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encouraging of that and then there's men that are not um lots of questions I have based on what you just said let's go

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with um how much do men actually know about the biological clock

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and how much do they know how much pressure it could put on a woman because I think we we're talking about like

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anxious attachment and anxious dating and I think that this pressure does form how we show up in dating sometimes

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whether we like it or not it does and I'm I'm curious to know you know how much men kind of are

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in tune to that or know that there is a biolog biological clock many women get stressed out and and you know pressured

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by that so I don't want to you know paint men with a broad brush just like I

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wouldn't say all women know this or don't know this right um but I think obviously speaking in

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generalities uh most men understand that fertility starts

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declining at 30 that by 35 it declines

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precipitously I think you know whenever I'm talking to my guy friends and stuff you know there's there's always that

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question like oh well how old is she right there's a reason that that there's this question about it they are thinking

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about it they are thinking about it right they are aware okay however I think there are there are two

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limitations to that the first thing is that they are not aware of how acutely

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aware most women are of that pressure so true right so even the woman who is

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posting on Instagram like I said before like we have to talk about that too yeah we will you know like live your life and

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like blah blah whatever it's all good like this kind of you know um quote unquote empowering message it's not

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actually empowering and we'll get to why um but but even the ones who are are

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saying that like they are not concerned about this deep down they are concerned

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about it in my experience so I think that you know sometimes guys and

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sometimes parents and even other women will say like oh you know she's 34 like she she needs to speed up like she needs

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to pick up the pace here she already knows that right no we don't need to be told that feeling that internally so so

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hard exactly so they you know again I don't want to speak on your behalf or

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the behalf of other women but my experience has been that they're already acutely aware of that pressure and I

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think that men don't truly understand that um the the other limitation is in

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addition to the fact that they may not know exactly what the process entails and then they may not you know

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necessarily have the the tools to communicate about it it so I think that they they should you know make

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themselves more aware if they're you should teach them all this stuff you thank you I try you should no you should

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start like a workshop for men to understand this stuff yeah it would yeah it would certainly be helpful very much

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so yeah um but I think I think the other limitation is that even though they know

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that women have this biological clock that they're very aware of they are not always conscientious

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about Protec the woman's time okay let's talk about that because we also talked about yes tell me more

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about that okay so this has two sides to it so the first side is you may be aware

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that a woman has a timeline that she needs to abide by obviously there's you

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know we have great technology these days egg freezing has allowed you to have a kid later in life thank God Etc right

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but if we want to play it safe you want to be sort of within the boundaries if you can okay yeah if you can it's not

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everybody's situation I think that guys know that but I think that when they get involved with a woman if they haven't

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made up their mind before getting involved with her what go ahead I'll

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share my story go ahead after you're done did I make you uncomfortable not at all I'm not uncomfortable at all no I'm

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happy to share all of my things if that man hasn't made up his mind before the

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first date with her that he wants to get married and he wants to have kids and he

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wants to do it soon and that if there are challenges he's going to roll with them then he's going to become enamored

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by her they're going to become involved and a year two years 3 years are going to go by and he may have just wasted

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some very very precious years of her time yeah if he hadn't made the if he didn't make the decision beforehand that

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he was ready for this who do you whose responsibility is that at that point right so maybe it's a shared

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responsibility whose responsibility if a year goes on two years go on well and I'll share with you my journey with Rob

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but who do whose responsibility is to say I don't think men take that

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responsibility to say hey well they don't unfortunately but but that's why I said there are two sides to this right

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it's a double-edged sword the other part of this is that a a man will often waste

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a woman's time but a woman will will often waste her own time speak to that right so she we've just established that

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she's often acutely aware of you know her situation and the fact that she wants to be on a certain timeline but

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just as the guy is susceptible to grow feelings for her and to want to make it work even if they're unclear about their

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timelines she is also susceptible to that yes and especially what I see in my

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practice all the time is if you have a girl who's been dating seriously since she was 22 or 24 hasn't found the right

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guy finally finds the right guy at age 35 she wants to hold on to him yeah right

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but then a couple of years go by and to answer the question of whose responsibility is it I think as you said

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it's a shared responsibility but you know you really you know if somebody I

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think I think that it's your responsibility if you have the timeline because because you cannot

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and I'm not trying to blame the victim here at all but you cannot assume that other people will be as conscientious

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about protecting your own time as you would be yeah I think what you okay you you know my story without telling my me

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telling my story but I think what you said is so right it's like for me meeting Roba 34 I had dated I had been

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in a lot of long-term relationships and then I was single for a while and dat a lot of people I knew what was out there I knew sort of the quality of things out

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there and I knew when I met Rob at 34 he was very different M and he was just it

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for me and I love him very much and he offered and brought things that no one else had brought you know secure

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attachment communication shout out to Rob Rob's the man I love him love you Rob

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um and you know there was a moment there that I was like I I would never want to

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give this up MH and you know I think when I met him well I know when I met

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him at 34 I was kind of like life is is going to evolve the way that it's going to evolve whether that's marriage or

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kids I don't know but I'll be happy either way now fast forward I get to be 36 is and the you know pressure timeline

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clock everything starts ticking and we weren't aligned there and so it wasn't something that we went into the

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relationship being like do we want these things I was kind of like you're great I love you this is fun let's do this and

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it wasn't until like 2 or 3 years into the Rel relationship I'm like okay what are we what are we doing for us it

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worked out um but it wasn't a conversation we had up front I didn't initiate that conversation because I didn't want to

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initiate that conversation but but did you know what you wanted at that time or were you still in like an exploratory

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phase I I wanted to be happy I had I had you know I had good relationships I

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never had great relationships I dated shitty people like I had bad picking you

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know the bad picker for for a while until I like figured my out um and at that point I just wanted to be happy

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and I just wanted to be with a good person and that's What mattered to me most and then so I wasn't saying I

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didn't want married or children I just was like I want to be happy I see okay you know I watched everyone else you

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know you see other people in not great relationships or not great marriages doing the traditional thing and they're not really happy and at before meeting

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Rob that was my decision whatever my life is going to look like I want to be happy um but then you know I grew to

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love him very much I loved his family and I just saw this future with him that I wanted I wanted to have children with

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him that's amazing yeah well what was hard was our timeline did not align but my biological clock right was ticking so

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that's why I froze at 37 while in a relationship with him and then you know it did work out for us so I think

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everybody's story is different um but I think as a woman that you know you do desire that partnership that secure

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attachment that relationship but it's so hard because when you don't have it and you find it

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it's hard to let go of that yeah even if they're not going to want the same things as you and then you

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and I did come up against a hard decision it's like if he's not going to want this I'm probably going to have to walk away from this right relationship

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so I think if you were my client like you know 10 years ago or whatever I I

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would have said two things to you based on this story and it's amazing and I'm so happy that it worked out for you

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thank you the first thing I would say is just for anybody who's listening who might be in a similar situation to uh

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where you were at 34 is get clear on what you want right and this is not to

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say that you think you did things incorrectly you did things beautifully and it worked out beautifully for you and I'm so happy about that thank you

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but it you're also saying that it caused some hardship because totally yeah you knew what you wanted at 34 and then a

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few years later you encountered this struggle right so the first thing I can say is the clearer you can get on what

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you want the better it will be be for your your own peace and for your relationship if and when you meet that

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right person yeah so if you know that you will be okay not having

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kids as okay as you would be if you have kids then that's great you have a little bit more you know leeway exactly to play

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with if you know there are some people that I work with who they since the time they were like 18 years old they

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absolutely know that they were born to be a mother and they won't have it anyway and they'll even go so far as to

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get a sperm donor by themselves if that's what comes to right so if you know that then you have to lead with

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that it doesn't mean that when you sit down at the dinner table you order the pasta and then the next question is like

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so are you ready to put a baby in me you know and I don't think most people do

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that that's kind of a Trope but yeah yeah yeah but it you know you you do have to lead is with that like that that

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has to be a conversation early on yeah and then to that of course people will say oh well aren't I going to scare him

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off if I tell him like that of course is an that's of course what women come up against and where they kind of you know

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waffle whether I say something or not or how I say something is that fear of scaring someone off yeah and you know

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how you're going to scare him off if he is afraid of that well exactly exactly

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because if he's not afraid of that he can hold space for that reive that yeah and it's almost better it's almost

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better to just lead with what you want and know whether or not they want it absolutely I wouldn't I you know it did

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work out for me it was a lot of hardship Rob's going to be pissed that I'm talking about this but whatever um I'm

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not sure I would recommend that for anyone there was a lot of Heartache for me there recommend what I would not

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recommend my my my mind worked out so I'm blessed and grateful but it was

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really it was really really hard that's exactly what I'm saying I'm saying for anybody listening like Beth's story

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worked out beautifully but there was hardship in there so to the extent that we can prevent that I think that getting

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extremely clear on what you want a and leading with what you want be is you

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know going to going to prevent some challenges and some hardship yeah and that's part of you know doing this podcast and sharing my story and being

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vulnerable is like you know hopefully it safeguards some people from some heartache or you know where I was

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to it when I was really ready to have children and wanted that it colored

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everything like things I would get upset I'd get about upset about things I would never get upset about like this idea

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that I was waiting or that I was wasting time I'm like you know if Rob was late to something I'm like see I'm just

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waiting around for him like it just it just eroded a lot of things it colored a lot of things so that was was really

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really challenging hard and that's why I say I don't recommend that for people yeah well you know that's I think why

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you and I do what we do beth like first of all we love people and we want to help people but secondly we went into

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this space of mental health because we had our own challenges and we probably

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made a lot of mistakes and learned things the hard way yes it's usually how you learn them yeah I think uh you know

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they say a smart person learns from their mistakes but a wise person learns

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from someone else's mistakes well I wasn't always the wise person unfortunately but me neither you know

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but that's that's why we're here um and look that point about being about scaring the guy off I really want to

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reiterate that how the only way that you will scare him off and this does happen I'm

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not I'm not trying to Gaslight you into thinking that you know this that there aren't guys out there who will be scared

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off by this they will but that is only if they are afraid of what you are

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proposing and that's why the deciding before the date is so important I want

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to share two anecdotes okay can I yes of course so the first is I went on a very

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prominent famous podcast in New York City I'll leave the name out and I had

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this conversation um about stating your intentions early on you know how many

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people you should date at one time and stuff like this and on the podcast I was

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recommending that within the first one or two or three dates you state if you

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are looking for this I want to be married and I want to have kids and the woman that I was talking to she said uh

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if a guy said that to me on the first date I would run away in the other direction

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and as we got more and more into the conversation it turns out that she is a

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very avoidant type of person yeah she doesn't enjoy these types of

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conversations and her plan when she got together with her now husband and father of her baby was not to have marriage and

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children right so she was she was turned off by that because that's not how she

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operates she she hadn't thought to herself about what she really wants and she's not you know she she was she was

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afraid of it exactly right so the that idea is not going to be palatable to

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somebody who's who's afraid of that or hasn't really tuned into to what their

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heart wants yeah I think the frustration again not to generalize but I think the frustration for women is this feeling

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that all men are afraid of it but that's not true I know it's not true but it sometimes it feels like that I I I

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totally understand why it feels that way a lot of men uh put that out they they

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they put that energy out a lot of them are still in their F boy phase you know

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but I promise you that it's not true that all men are afraid of that yeah and I don't want to unfairly generalize I

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think that and maybe there is something to you know obviously who we choose and all of those things but I think fear P

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like we just get the sense that men are afraid of these things like these of having children of the commitment of

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marriage and women want those things well a lot of the time we think that we

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want something but wanting something and being prepared for it are two different

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things I love that yeah speak to let's talk about that so you know they say

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um you don't attract what you want you attract what you are have you heard this phrase yes yes it's it's kind of true

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it's it's it's a little bit too simplistic but just to use that as an

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example um if you keep attracting men who are emotionally unavailable or

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afraid of commitment you want to use that as a jumping off point to ask yourself this

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question instead of asking yourself I want to get married I want kids why do I keep attracting this type of guy flip

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the narrative for a second and ask yourself why don't don't I want to get

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married what am I afraid of what are my fears and

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obstacles even just the fact that I think men out there don't want this or

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they won't be open to it is an obstacle in and of itself maybe there's something deep down in me that actually doesn't

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want commitment and doesn't want kids yeah and is afraid of those things

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because the experience that I've had is showing me that what I want is not available to me so that's a block in me

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right so if you can look at what is happening and take that as an

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opportunity take that as a mirror and look within yourself then magically I

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see this happen over and over again bet yeah you're going to start attracting a different type of person it's just

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having that ability to to turn the mirror on yourself and and that's what I did and that's I think what you know

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invited Rob into my life because I was like you know I was choosing the emot un available people I'm like okay you know

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I'm why am I picking these people and then under this understanding that about myself allowed me to see Rob more clearly I was getting in my own way

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wasting my own time because I wasn't understanding what was coming up for me and I just told the story just before on

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the last episode I thought I was open I thought I was open to meeting somebody until somebody like stopped me in my

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tracks I was like you're not open at all I was like oh damn so I had to stop and really look at myself I

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think yeah that's that's the Turning Point that's when you can change the game and be more successful in dating

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and maybe get more clear on what you want absolutely so instead of looking at your dating life as this landfill it's

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just like pile of where nothing is going nothing's going right you know look at it as as a mirror right and and

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hold the mirror up to yourself and ask yourself you know could I am I holding

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on to a negative energy that perhaps is stopping me do I have traumas that I haven't worked through through and then

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of course look you know there are people who are doing everything they've can they they can and they've done a lot of

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healing and then it's a matter of timing yeah you know but my problem with the

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self-help movement on Instagram and books and podcasts and stuff is that it

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is skipping to step 10 out of 10 okay

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and what I mean by this is steps 1 2 3 all the way through nine are look within

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yourself fix yourself get a therapist get a coach change your energy learn to

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become more optimistic have more faith relinquish control Etc relinquish control that one's tough yeah learn how

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to communicate properly right love yourself steps one through nine well and the beauty of that too yeah sorry to cut

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you off it's okay steps 1 through n are all of that step 10 is you're doing

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everything you can you are where you need to be trust your process patience patience the right

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person will come well and the beauty of 1 through n is like it's not just going to serve you in dating it's going to serve you in everything absolutely

29:41

so this quotee unquote empowerment and encouragement that we see in this space

29:48

is skipping to self to step number 10 we are telling people instead of telling them what you

29:55

and I are talking about here which is get to that fulcrum get to that Turning Point within yourself use this

30:02

experience as a mirror cultivate your faith learn how to communicate better learn how to be

30:08

confident in yourself all these things instead we're skipping over all of that and we're just telling people you're

30:14

great you're good where you are everything is supposed to happen at the right time that's a message that people

30:21

should be hearing down the line once they have laid the foundation there's so

30:26

much bad messaging out there and I think that's why these conversations are so important and I think the time piece

30:32

might come into play too because that stuff takes time and when you're 35 3 34

30:38

35 you know you might not want to dedicate the time to that or you might feel like that's the waste of time which

30:44

is not true at all right might be daunting and overwhelming to be like oh my God I have to do Step 1 through nine

30:49

before I can meet anybody and you're just like I I don't want to do it I I need to meet somebody yesterday but the value and the shift and what happens

30:56

when you do that is tremendous and it is what's going to make you successful well let me clarify something I'm not trying

31:03

to say that you need to be whole or complete sure sure sure in order to meet someone cuz that's another piece of

31:09

Internet nonsense is this idea that like you need to be 100% on your own before

31:15

Mr Wright or Mrs Wright will do you know stact do you know his work yeah oh my God for love yeah yeah yeah he's great I

31:21

love speaks to that a lot that you can learn secure attachment through relationship 100% And and that and that

31:28

the relationship is the context in which a lot of the healing actually occurs right so my sort of heris for this is

31:35

you don't need to be a 100% you don't need to have completed steps 1 through nine they can be in process but you need

31:43

to be 60 or 70% of the way there right so your airplane doesn't need to be a

31:49

Decked Out private jet but it needs to be safe enough to fly oh I love that

31:55

right so you would not step onto an airplane that you knew had a broken wing

32:00

or a faulty engineering system that's when you see a person who has issues up

32:06

the Wazoo and your fixer mentality gets in there don't step onto his or her

32:11

airplane but oh I love that I do you use that like I love using like metaphors and symbol like Sy symbols in my work

32:19

because it just lets clients like really like attached to something for sure but on the flip side if in good if you're

32:26

dating in good conscience you would not let somebody step onto your airplane if

32:31

you were aware that you had a broken wing or a faulty engineering system so we have all these people out there who

32:38

have broken wings they have stuff that they need to to work on that that is is stopping them and we're jumping to step

32:45

number 10 and we're telling them you're perfect the way you are just wait for the right guy to come on the plane but

32:51

that's not going to serve him or you right you have to first do the internal

32:56

work as they say but the but the caveat is you don't have to be perfect right it just has to be in

33:03

progress I like that I think that's like less daunting and overwhelming than saying like you know be perfect or like

33:09

yeah that's why I love Stanton's work because not like you don't have to do the one through nine yeah there there

33:14

are two pieces of like pure unadulterated crap that float around in

33:20

this space okay one of them is you need to be single on purpose you need to be 100%

33:28

healed on your own all of your childhood traumas need to be sorted out before you're going to be in a relationship

33:35

okay that's horseshit excuse my language you can curse that's fine the other piece of nonsense is what I've been

33:40

talking about which is you're perfect the way you are you're exactly where you need to be it's just a matter of timing

33:46

that's also nonsense the truth is somewhere right in the middle yeah which is you have work to do I have work to do

33:53

get that work in progress finding your soulmate is

33:58

more an inside job than it is an external Expedition yeah right but you

34:05

don't have to be perfectly healed because if you're in the right relationship so much of the healing and

34:12

fulfillment is going to occur in that in the context of that relationship I think

34:18

that's so I mean it's incredibly helpful to hear and I think about all the narratives and I'm sure you hear them

34:23

all too all the narratives that come up especially for this demographic of women that are you know 30s late 30s 40s that

34:29

haven't met somebody and are egg freezing is you know they don't want to settle M right and so maybe they're

34:36

looking for the perfect guy that's already healed that's already done the work and when and I don't know if you

34:42

see this show up in your work I'm assuming you do but some with some of my female clients it's they're not willing

34:48

to open the the perspective on someone different or someone outside of what

34:54

they've chosen or someone outside of who they have envisioned to be their partner or the father of their children and you

35:00

know there is this there is this narrative or or thought that comes up that by suggesting that you do say open

35:06

up it's like well I don't want to sett I don't want to settle do you see I'm sure you see that in your work I do and I

35:12

hate the word settling I really I really hate that that whole concept because

35:19

here's the truth finding somebody who is good enough first of all is not settling and

35:27

secondly finding somebody who is good enough is incredibly

35:33

rare it is extremely difficult to find someone who's good enough see I hear

35:39

what you're saying but I already know women are going to hear this and say good enough is not good enough well well hear me out yeah I'm willing to hear you

35:45

out I'm just I'm already like projecting down line when this goes on you know goes live that so first of all my

35:51

definition of good enough is not that you're miserable with some guy who sits

35:56

on the couch smokes weed all day and bosses you around the house like that's not good enough that's that's miserable

36:02

right my definition of good enough is also not that like yeah you're kind of happy but you're kind like not really

36:07

fulfilled and stuff like that my def definition of good enough is that you

36:14

have three or four pillars one is you have the same values M two is you have a

36:19

similar vision of The Future Three is you have attraction and

36:25

chemistry and four is you can communicate with this person I love

36:31

those pillars now all of the other stuff trust and honesty and respect and like

36:36

those are they're they're kind of like nonar like they're they're non-negotiable right you need to have

36:42

those there right but finding someone that you have the same values you have a

36:47

shared vision of the future you are attracted to them and you don't want to rip each other's heads off when you're

36:52

communicating is extremely rare I don't say that to discourage people I say that

36:59

the reason I'm saying this is if we understand that over the course of a lifetime you have about five to six

37:08

potential soul mates that's it if you ask spiritual teachers they'll tell you this right you have like four to six

37:15

people with whom you can actually have a nice fulfilled stable calm life it's

37:22

very very rare if you find one of those you're going to be happy with them

37:28

I think the clarity of those pillars are so helpful and deciding that that's what is important to you is so helpful

37:33

because then you know what you're looking for I think unfortunately sometimes those pillars look very different for people and what they're

37:39

telling themselves is important to them so I love the way that you you broke those down I think that's really helpful

37:46

yeah and look every person has to have a hierarchy of importance because you cannot

37:51

prioritize what's important to you all on the same level so you meet men and women who who are they're what I call

37:59

maximizers you know a girl who for example wants a guy who's six feet with green eyes already financially

38:05

established you know has a house is ready for her to just walk into his life has worked on all of his emotional

38:11

baggage right you're you're trying to maximize across all categories you need

38:17

to decide which one of those things in order is most important I have a funny

38:22

story about that my friend had this waxer she's like this cute little Russian lady and she's like you ladies

38:27

just so old she's like you ladies want this this you want 10 things she's like you get two you get two of those things

38:32

but it's all those kind of more superficial things like I eye color financial status sure but you can't yeah

38:39

you can't have all of them you can have all of them but not all prioritized at

38:44

number one well I think that becomes the problem it have to be all of those things ex they all have to fall into a

38:49

hierarchy and and men do this all the time as well they're like I want a girl who's in great shape she's you know 27

38:56

or under and she doesn't have baggage and she's not going to be emotional and blah blah blah right like you can have all the

39:03

things that you want but they you have to decide what is in order of priority

39:08

and I can tell everybody who's listening right now that there is one thing that is more important than anything else if

39:15

you have this as your number one you're already ahead of the game which is you

39:21

and your partner need to have identical values you need to Value the same things

39:26

in life you need to have a very very similar mindset on what is important to

39:31

teach your kid and the principles by which you live if you have that your your marriage or

39:38

your relationship can Outlast most troubles that come up if you have different values then your marriage is

39:45

going to crumble yeah I think what's important about just sort of you know the the narrative around time or wasting

39:51

time is that there is so much value in experience and I think through dating through relationships through experience

39:57

you start to learn what your own values are you start to learn the ones that are important and you know I had other long-term relationships before Rob and I

40:04

you know at this point would never say those were a waste of time because I learned so much about what I wanted what

40:09

I needed you know my my relation I had a 5-year relationship before Rob and you know his family was you know broken and

40:17

dysfunctional and you know I thought I was okay with that and that sort of was one of the things that led to the

40:22

downfall of a relationship and and I left that I learned that that that was important and I left that and I said I

40:28

want to be with somebody who was raised similarly to me had the similar values and you know and that is Rob and that is

40:34

Rob's family and that has supported the success of our relationship so much so I

40:39

think you know when The Narrative of wasting time comes up I try to encourage people that nothing is wasted that

40:44

there's always if you're looking at it in the right way and you're taking something from it that is going to serve you in the future there's like no wasted

40:52

time absolutely and one thing to highlight about what you just said is I

40:57

hate when people are shamed for being picky about what they want like you wanted a guy who wasn't from a broken

41:03

family so to speak and a lot of people could look at you Beth and they could say oh well that's so messed up and

41:09

judgmental you know you don't have any control over what happens in their family and you should accept the person

41:15

for who she is blah her who he is blah blah blah you're allowed to want what you want you know and I think that part

41:22

of the the the narrative around this settling thing is there's so much pressure on people

41:28

to not be picky there's so much pressure on them to uh you know just take

41:34

whatever is is given to you kind of thing that yeah of course they become afraid of settling right so we should

41:42

not be telling we should not be shaming people for having the values they do or wanting the things they do if you want a

41:49

rich guy that's great if you want a tall guy that's fine right the only thing is

41:54

you have to understand that first first of all if you find somebody who is good enough that's very rare and you you know

42:02

good enough is great because if you've got those pillars covered you're going to have a happy life and secondly there

42:11

has to be an order of prioritization yeah right so if having a rich guy is your number one thing that's fine but

42:19

then numbers two three four and five they have to go below that they can't all be number one at number one and

42:26

here's the reason the reason is that if all of your things are number one then you actually price

42:34

yourself out of the market I've heard that quite a bit yeah right so you don't

42:39

want to have you want to have high standards of respect for yourself but you don't want to have such

42:46

high standards of what you expect from the other person that the other person

42:51

becomes illusory yeah you you we we all have to operate within the current

42:57

dating market and the current dating Market has a lot of people with a lot of baggage who haven't done work on

43:02

themselves and don't have all the things you want so sure it's you know sometimes it might feel like finding a needle and

43:08

hay stack you know um but you don't want to price yourself out of the market you

43:14

still you want to have high standards of self-respect but not such high standards

43:19

of expectation o yeah I think that happens a lot right yeah yeah before we

43:25

wrap up I want to talk quickly about this we talked about the Nuance piece and you mentioned a little bit earlier about you know there's a lot on there

43:31

about social media of like 38 and traveling the world and all of these things and you and I talked about that in our previous call of just how that

43:38

could be a little problematic that being the messaging right and and sort of what is the balance between being grateful

43:44

for where you're at but also planning if you want children and partnership like planning being proactive and strategic

43:52

well I think you you um relay that Nuance really really effectively thank

43:58

you I've seen some of the things you you've posted and some I've listened to some of your conversations so first tell

44:03

me what's your perspective um I think there's got to be

44:09

a balance to it and finding that balance because I know for me I made the mistake of being too fixated on what I didn't

44:15

have yet that I wasn't focusing what I had now so I do think some of that messaging is encouraging and is helpful

44:21

to say hey just because you're not married and don't have kids doesn't mean life is over or your life is less than

44:26

um but I do think that there is this piece of reality that you know if you do want

44:33

children at a certain age you have to start to think about and who knows you know you only get a surface level of what people are actually going through

44:38

and you know you can't base it all on what they're posting so maybe they are thinking about that but I think there is a balance and I think there is an

44:45

importance to be grateful for what you have now while also planning for what you want in the future MH mhm yes that's

44:52

beautiful I would add to that one thing which is um emotional

44:58

authenticity and what I mean is um you know I've had clients who are this type

45:05

of uh Instagram they they promote this type of Instagram messaging of like you're 38 you're traveling the world

45:12

you're living your best life like you know just be grateful for where you are on your journey and stuff if you peel

45:17

the curtain back a little bit they're not happy that's not what they mean yeah

45:24

that is a Trope that has been sold to them that they are now perpetuating but

45:30

in our heart of hearts even if you are the most free spirited hippie dippy you

45:37

know trust the universe person on Earth and I love all that stuff by the way I pray every day and I meditate and I go

45:42

to an energy healer nice like I'm not bashing that stuff but even if you are

45:47

all of that in our heart of hearts we are born and bred to attach and to be

45:57

dependent on another human being it doesn't mean that you are not also

46:03

self-sufficient right but healthy dependency is not a preference it's not

46:09

a choice and it's not something that's up for debate on Instagram it is a

46:16

biological physiological and psychological necessity so no matter how much we tell

46:24

people that you know the single life is great even if you're happy being single

46:31

which you should be right there is still a lack of

46:37

authenticity and the truth is that your life with the right partner would be

46:43

better and that in your deepest heart that's what you want and I think that there is so much power and Liberation in

46:51

being able to admit that if you can admit that then you can start the

46:57

process of getting closer and closer to that yeah I think it gets hard to admit

47:02

that because then it could it could introduce or invite some sadness around not having it there's so much sadness

47:08

around not having it and and it also part of the reason that that people post

47:14

this facade on Instagram and make books and podcasts out of it around this this one very concept is that if you can

47:21

disavow what you want in your heart then you're lowering your expectations

47:27

if you can admit to what you want in your heart then your expectations could

47:32

be disappointed and that's a very scary thing to Embark I'm sorry that's a very scary thing to confront right

47:41

but the power that you gain from being authentic with yourself in what you

47:46

truly want in addition to the fact that that allows you to now start to

47:52

approximate and approach getting what you want is in valuable yeah and I

47:58

always tell people don't make Instagram your boyfriend right or your girlfriend

48:04

like don't go to social media or books or podcasts or gurus to validate Your

48:12

Existence and validate where you are in your life what you need is

48:17

self-sufficiency and self-love and a partner and that's what you want in your

48:23

deepest heart and and anybody who says otherwise has either just been burned

48:29

many many times and they're scared it's their defense mechanism to say that they're not yes yeah right exactly well

48:36

thank you so much for being here I we could talk for hours unfortunately we don't have hours but tell everybody where they can find you thank you so

48:42

much this is an amazing conversation amazing well we'll have to do it again there's much more to talk about yeah for sure um you can message me online uh my

48:49

Instagram is Kevin n High also my Tik Tok um or my website Kevin high.com okay

48:56

Kevin thank you so much for being here thank you Beth if you like the episodes that you're hearing and you want to hear more please subscribe to our Channel and

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stay tuned for more incredible stories and tools when I froze my eggs at 37 I

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